Baby steps, but steps nonetheless
Published by Peter | Filed under Development
Sorry for not giving prominence to this before, but thanks to monkeycat for highlighting these plans for the development of the snooker hall on Camberwell New Road (caution: large PDF download). It also gives a history of previous applications for that site. I’m sure something is going to be granted sooner rather than later, and it will be the biggest transformation of the centre since *shudder* Butterfly Walk.
So with plans for the centre, and South Camberwell getting a little love in the shape of changes to Denmark Hill, what’s going on in the North?
Work has begun on improvements to Chumleigh Gardens; there are new play areas, ‘playable landscaping’ (whatever that means), and a newly refurbished cafe on the way. Chumleigh Gardens is a lovely location to have breakfast in summer, so a decent cafe to go with it will be great.
The five companies shortlisted for the larger Burgess Park development held a ‘speed-dating’ event recently, in which they briefly met local community representatives to hear their ideas and aims.
A page on the Southwark Council website shows the order of the task ahead of them; Burgess Park, at 50 hectares, is receiving £6m in investment — marginally more than Potter’s Field Park (£3m for 1.5 hectares), and substantially less than Mile End Park (£40m for 36 hectares). Quite an eye-opener, although it does, at least, manage our expectations for what can be achieved.
I’d like to see a running/cycling track put all around the perimeter of the park (at least the side to the east of Wells Way), better lighting, and better entrances. And, it goes without saying, a zoo (although seeing the available budget, that may just have to consist of a rabbit hutch).
If you’re a Facebook user, there’s a Burgess Park page with all the latest news; if you’re not, then you’re not well catered for at all.
Update: Out of three possible options to extend the Bakerloo line, Burgess Park is in the favoured two. Camberwell Green, however, looks unlikely to benefit.
I have always found Burgess park a bit of a desert.
The trees are young and therefore a little small and give not a lot of shade on a hot day. Not that we’ve had many.
Chumley Gardens is an oasis in that desert. They used to sell wine once but not now which is a bit of a shame.
BE THERE OR B SKWARE. Sceaux Gardens Summer Festival today and tomorrow 12-5pm both days. Sunday 3-4pm tree planting memorial to those who died in the fire. Both days have art, bouncy castle, crafts, dance, dressing up, everything free, football & basketball, great “Karrot Bus” kourtesy of the Met full of perfectly legal high tech wii-fii wonders, lots of marvellous nice perfect quality refreshments, such a nice time for all, u very well xllnt yzee!
Perhaps the council — Neuilly? — will have a professional ironist on hand to explain the French Revolution names of the flats — Florian, Lakanal, etc.
The presentation plans for the snooker hall focus a lot on what’s already there over what WILL be there if the application goes through. Lot of red ink on that arrowhead shape for the site’s footprint. Again and again. Very touchy feely it seems with a lot of respect for the neighbourhood and a load of alternative facias for the new build. Where’s that bit going? Seems like all the architect’s ideas came off the drawing board for that one, even though I might have missed a lot having had to turn my computer on its side to read the pdf.
Anyhow. I cannot continue to live and work in Camberwell and not see things improve slower than the pace of a glacier in retreat. And I cannot afford to move, and we, my family and I, don’t really want to move because we have so many close friends and families here… but at the same time I hate feeling it’s so desperate being here…
SO. I’m thinking of standing to be a local councillor at next year’s elections. My manifesto will be to consolidate all the research, consultation and scoping exercises that Neighbourhood Renewal has done and help make things HAPPEN. I’d expect to take an entrepreneurial approach to Camberwell’s regeneration, based on what people have been saying for a very long time, and to work with existing bodies — Camberwell Festival, SE5 Forum, Camberwell Society, Friends of Camberwell Baths, Camberwell College, South London Gallery, shopkeepers, residents and many others as well as both local authorities to bring joined up working to what happens to our area. My aim will be to make Camberwell recognised widely as the centre of excellence and excitement it is already but is not known for. And a few other things — all suggestions gratefully recieved. Oh yes. A town centre manager is one thing I’d be pushing for.
This will be a big step for me — well out of my comfort zone — and I would really appreciate some feedback for my proposal.
What do you think?
I think you’re a glutton for punishment, but I know very few people with a knowledge of (and interest in) the area like yours, and I’d vote for you.
Yes you should do it. Make sure you pick the right ward though. Might I suggest Brunswick Park as a sympathetic demographic to you.
I think you are a saint. You have my vote.
Will you sort out the Noodels sign? What’s happened with that anyway, didn’t someone say the planners were on it?
I think a few more of us should stand up and be part of the Camberwell Party…(People’s Republic of Camberwell anyone?)
Reasons:
1. More voices shout louder.
2. More chance of getting support (ie c ash) from others as a group.
3. Easier than standing as an independent.
4. Stops sitting on backsides complaining on this website.
5. Safety in numbers. Mutual support and not so out of comfort zone.
Ah thanks Monkeycat. If Mr Dodds is a supporter of the socialists cause promoted by The People’s Republic then we shall back him 100%!
@mark: good luck, camberwell desperately needs an independent candidate! or a green one!
re other stuff in totally random order:
- reclaim the magistrates court as the centre for camberwell communities
- extend congestion charge zone up to denmark hill station (to cover the whole of walworth and camberwell)
- encourage more local food growing
- have a vegan cafe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- reclaim high street to local communities and businesses (as opposed to churches and chains or chains and churches)
- create safe spaces for pedestrians and cyclists
- involve young people and school children in decision making processes
TfL are looking again at extending the Bakerloo. Going to Camberwell Green is the least favoured option, but Burgess Park is viable.
@ Streetfighter:
My comment about the People’s Republic of Camberwell is a tongue in cheek reference to my obsessional love of Camberwell, and how it stands out from the uniformity of gentrification that the rest of South London seems to suffer from I fear you may be a bit more serious.
Socialism, in the form you advocate, does not and will not ever win votes enough to get into any form of meaningful power. Sorry.
Well vote Green, it isn’t far off and adheres to most of the same principles, then we’ll get along fine. Baby steps.
Go for it Mark, you’ll get a vote from me.
Liliana says:
08/24/2009 at 4:18 pm
“- reclaim the magistrates court as the centre for camberwell communities”
Good idea, but where would you move the court to?
“- extend congestion charge zone up to denmark hill station (to cover the whole of walworth and camberwell)”
Bad idea. Business is hard enough in Camberwell as it is.
“- encourage more local food growing”
Good idea.
- have a vegan cafe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You can’t, as a counciller make people open a cafe. It would be a loser from the off.
“- reclaim high street to local communities and businesses (as opposed to churches and chains or chains and churches)”
Your idea of a congestion charge would kill that stone dead.
“- create safe spaces for pedestrians and cyclists”
Good idea.
“- involve young people and school children in decision making processes”
Good idea.
I had no idea that Camberwell had its own building society…once upon a time…
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/6069620/Skeletons-in-Chelseas-cupboard-provide-an-expensive-lesson.html
@Mark — a doubtless improvement on incumbents. I will vote for the candidate who is committed to making it harder to leave Camberwell to shop, and easier to visit it, by car. That would cost zilch but require tremendous political courage. If you’re worried about the 100th nail bar/betting shop appearing in our postcode, there’s no other way.
@Monkeycat — it’s great that you have found your mojo. But planning the streets and new developments around the idea of maximising car ownership is the real modern day gentrification, not some twee Dulwich Village nightmare. And Camberwell does not need an unmitigated red route piling through it, with carte blanche brutalist development, in order to retain its “edge”.
Very few London communities are as gentrified as Camberwell. The existence of a deprived community is irrelevant — they can be moved wholesale at any time (witness Elephant & Castle) as planners move forward with the minimum 35% private housing strategy, reducing overall household numbers simultaneously. A few token grant initiatives and photo-ops will secure poor votes at election time, according to the voting habits of forefathers, so planners need not consider or interact with them, as we do not on this blog.
In South London, Deptford High Street and Lewisham have far more successful and progressive planning approaches than in SE5. In Camberwell, such methods of localism, community inclusiveness and defence of heritage would be dismissed as “gentrification”, despite their economic and social benefits to the lowest income groups, as recognised by LPAC and English Heritage.
yep, sort out the Noodels sign and get a Camberwell town centre manager. Good stuff.
Oh, and stop cyclists from going through red lights and from riding on the footpaths. Saw another pedestrian nearly skittled today by one of them.
Shotguns to all corner shop owners.
Better snacks in cafes. I’m doing it!
Thanks for the encouragement by the way. Appreciated.
sorry, SG but what on earth are you talking about? Listen to yourself… Let me paraphrase…
“A cyclist just went through a red light. Someone should do something about it…I will write a message on a blog to express my annoyance.”
No, I hope that my elected representative will do nothing about the person who cycled through a red light. If he decides to do so and gets injured or killed, it will be his or her fault. They know that it is illegal and (potentially) stupid. Let them decide. And I say this as a cyclist who goes through red lights. When there are no cars or pedestrians.
Actually, yes I hope Mark does something. I hope he campaigns for cyclists to be allowed to go through red lights when it is safe to do so.
Think I’d fall into Monkeycat’s red light district on that one. But how to make going through red lights legal for cyclists in SE5 is a tad complicated.
Can’t remember where I read it, but I read that plans to let cyclists turn left at red lights are being considered.
Cyclists — the only untrained, untested road users out there, and doesn’t it show.
“- involve young people and school children in decision making processes”
They already do that don’t they? Wasn’t a retard with a pack of crayolas responsible for some of the recent regeneration plans?
Course, I have my bronze and silver cycling proficiency certificates from primary school.
“Cyclists — the only untrained, untested road users out there” — apart from anyone on a moped or low-power motorbike, such as pizza delivery boys.
I’d like to see the Amsterdam model introduced here; a cyclist is legally never at fault in a collision with a car.
Peter, you have to get a certificate of Compulsory Basic Training for that. That involves a long day of training and £120 or something. It’s not a formality. I was the only one out of my class of four to pass it. It’s then only valid two years.
In certain cases you can ride a 50cc if your car licence is old enough. Doubt most pizza boys fall into that. Also hardly any geared motorbike is under 125cc, so you need a CBT.
As a general rule, anyone with a full British motorbike licence has been through a lot of training and a difficult test that has recently become even harder.
I know there are some stupid idiots but in general they are some of the best and most considerate road users out there. Despite their skill it’s a dangerous way to travel though, no doubt.
I am a keen cyclist and follow the pro sport closely. There are idiots on all forms of transport, but some of the cyclists in London are just contemptible. I’d almost say that I’d like to see some of them hit by a car, but of course I wouldn’t really wish that on them. I just wish some had a bit more consideration, respect, and foresight, and that there was less of an “I’m a cyclist so I’m more vulnerable so I’m right and f–k you” sort of attitude.
I think the left turn at red lights was mooted in London either by Boris or TfL. It was under review but no news yet and probs unlikely to be implemented. It has been run overseas in some places, I think.
@phil g:
what i wanted to say was that kids are incredibly inspiring, creative & largely uninhibited by ‘how things need to be done/are done’ rubbish
we all had this, it just gets harder & harder to remember, after years of societies and education and employments and life in general
@ monkeycat — I wasn’t writing to “express my annoyance” as you put it but to highlight what I see as a growing problem in Camberwell.
Hopefully something that Mark, if he became a councillor, could help address –maybe by working with the Safer Neighbourhood Team, perhaps by directing them to particular areas where there are problems. I understand the SNT are able to issue cyclists with warnings or similar.
I saw a cyclist go through a red light at the Wyndham Road junction at high speed last Friday afternoon and nearly knock a pedestrian over. It could have been quite nasty.
A friend said police were issuing tickets to cyclists who were riding on pavements in Camberwell the other day — not sure where, though.
I ride a scooter and have respect for everyone on the road who also obeys the road rules. “Stop at red lights” being the main one.
Thinking about it though Mark, I’d much rather see you take on the Silver Buckle than disappear into local politics.
That would probably have a bigger beneficial impact on the area.
What happened to that idea?
number of cyclists dying as a result of a traffic accident (while using the roads and obeying the traffic regulations) is on the rise.
cars who park on pavements did not teleport themselves there although talking to a police person you might just think that. a few years back i had a brush with an aggressive car owner who was adamant about driving onto the pavement island by the bus stops in front of edwards bike shop. they’ve cleared them since on that particular location but everyone’s still happily turning blind eyes to cars on pavements elsewhere.
i find the whole outrage at the cyclists really quite hipocritical under the circumstances. and i probably can’t spell but what the hell
yep, cars who don’t obey the rules are just as bad, I totally agree.
As are pedestrians. My point is not about cyclists per se, but about cyclists — and any road users for that matter — who don’t obey the road rules.
“stop at red lights being the main one”.
And before the advanced stop box, I presume, in accordance with Rule 178 of the Highway Code.
Liliana is right to scent hypocrisy — anyone truly concerned with preventing human death and injury from vehicles would focus on enforcement against the malfeasants statistically proven to cause over 99% of it. Monkeycat is also right — it’s about annoyance. No concern for humanity here, move on, move on.
ok, I can see I’m a little outnumbered.
Go right ahead, ride on pavements, run red lights — but could you at least put a bell on your bikes to warn those of us that might dare to be in your path ??
Thanks.
Good one sg. Democracy in action. Thanks for that Alan, Silver Buckle is still an idea but a few things are getting in the way. Can’t explain exactly what. Heard that Antic Ltd are interested — they of EDT and Dog Star and a number of other pubs. Realistically they’d have more chance of getting it than me — I’ve been at loggerheads with S&NPE for a decade and have no money. But that’s never stopped me trying before.
The past few times I’ve sat outside Le PP we’ve been approached by beggars. So, it really is just like Paris.
Haven’t got time to read all the posts just at the moment but I wanted to add my support to your idea Mark, I think you’d be great and would definitely vote for you.
Regards
GF
The position on the Noodels sign is that Southwark took enforcement action, Noodels appealed, and the appeal is now being considered by the Planning Inspectorate — this is a national body, based in Bristol. Seems to be a very lengthy business.
Hi Mark, I’ve never met you, but you seem like you’d be a great representative from what I’ve read here and on the SE5 Forum.
Probably you should check you don’t run against someone else who already does a lot of good for the area/community.
Disclaimer: I have very little knowledge of how local politics is set up.
Cheers Carole. Let’s hope their appeel failz. Wonder what their case is. We meant it like that? Don’t think so as the subsignage below the windows has it spelled correctly.
Mark. You could do well as the younger cooler vote and some marketing via S+D and other pubs would help. However, vote would be spread across several wards, and many of them won’t even be registered.
Cyclists should have some sort of insurance if they go on the road. Because if they run somebody over causing a nasty injury and they had to take time off work… who pays for that! if a car knocked a cyclist off there bike they would want to claim from the car drivers insurance…
@SDF I don’t think cyclists on the road are a major problem, perhaps on the pavement they are a danger to pedestrians, but this is against the law.
If a motorised vehicle knocks someone off their bike the chances of them sustaining serious, or even deadly, injuries is very high.
I think you’ll find deaths and injuries caused by cyclists is extremely low.
Personally I would have thought uninsured car drivers to be of far greater concern.
@joe
A couple of weeks ago I was on my scooter on Denmark hill (just finished work)I was waiting to turn into De Crespigny Park. The car coming towards me flashed his lights for me to turn (which was quite a distance) and this cyclist from the side of the car decided to speed up as I turned and crashed into my thigh! which caused me to fall off my bike badly bruised and swollen leg. he just rode off leaving me stuck under my bike and I had to take a few days off work…
I’m just glad there wasn’t much more damage to myself or my bike..
I’m not going on about all cyclist! Something needs to be done to calm all the traffic down
@SDF Very sorry to hear that, and glad you were only bruised in the incident. If I understand the scenario correctly, then I don’t think the cyclist has done anything wrong (apart from leaving the scene of an accident perhaps), they would be under no obligation to stop just because a car has and, as you are crossing oncoming traffic, it is their right of way.
You’d actually fail a driving test for flashing someone in that scenario, the only acceptable reason for flashing is to alert others to you presence. I know it is common for people to flash their lights in this way, but the situation you describe is precisely the reason why they should not. I just checked this and the Highway Code states:
“Never assume that flashing headlights is a signal inviting you to proceed. Use your own judgement and proceed carefully. ”
I would sympathise that cyclists can ride quite aggressively, I do think that you have to be very assertive as a cyclist in London and I believe that this assertiveness can often lead aggressiveness.
I’d absolutely agree that something needs to be done to calm traffic.
We are all invincible until we are dead.
We should, what ever vehicle we are on, in or on top of should firstly SLOW DOWN and then be aware of all other road and pavement users.
Yes, much as I’d like to back a scooter man, I’d agree with JoeD that the cyclist had right of way. That situation you have described catches both parties out.
Where I work near Oxford St pedestrians are now often wary to cross a ped crossing on a green light because they half fear some messenger / ‘fakenger’ tit on a fixed wheel will come flying through. That’s not right.
On my ride back tonight on a motorbike I had some idiot carve in front of me near Elephant (didn’t look before pulling out). Could’ve hit him but I anticipated that he would do this. I also saw a few ignore a woman waiting at a zebra crossing. Loads jumped red lights etc.
The worst was coming through SE5. Some smackhead on a tiny BMX working his way through a McDs (and chucking the rubbish away in the street) weaving around. Sort that usually rides on the pavement.
Injuries caused by cyclists are very low. I think a death caused by someone cycling on the pavement was in the news a few months ago because it was such a rare event.
Course, on my ride home tonight there were plenty of totally fine and well behaved commuter cyclists and a couple of club racing cyclists too, so it wasn’t a war or anything, and we all got home. Rant over.
Anyway, back to places to eat in Camberwell .….…
Only one last thing to say, I was waiting patiently on Denmark hill to turn, not as though I’d just went on my own accord. A car driver would just have turned… as a few of them are inpatient
Oh well! as Sg would say “ride / drive / walk defensively is the moral of the story
Yes Camberwell.… any new shops or restaurants opened up recently?
AT THE END OF THE OVAL TEST people were playing cricket in the street by the old Cricketers pub. Mike Gatting walked past. They offered him the tennis ball and he bowled one. He looked like an old Shakespearean actor. In fact he looked like King Lear himself.
Sceaux Gardens festival was led by troopers and starred some stars. A very bright lad on the main stage, aged maybe 13, wearing Elvis Costello glasses, was selling various items including a nubile blonde girl aged about 15. Eventually, he asked the audience to put in a bid for themselves. “Yes,” he said, “you’re going to buy yourselves.”
The badge-making team from Southwark Libraries were the best badging crew out there since the miners’ strike.
A troupe of young girls sang Rihanna’s “Umbrella” complete with umbrellas, led by a proper singing woman who got them to start all over again and finish properly.
The six memorial trees planted include plum and pear trees.
The South London Gallery’s Wednesday afternoon 3-5pm children’s creative play sessions have V&A standard creative coaching at south London prices, i.e. free. The Gallery is a very inspiring space altogether to work in.
The Bickleigh is to be a new art space, yes? The pubs croak, but the Camberwell moves on.
On the subject of food…
The Metro supermarket has closed. V. sad since the staff were lovely, the prices cheaper than Morrisons or Somerfield, The feta divine, and the meat weren´t bad either.
Apparently, landload hiked up the rent and the owner was in Turkey and couldn’t be bothered.
Cue…rants from someone on this blog about imminent opening of nail bar / church / drinking den / bookies / indian restaurant / NASA sub branch / Masonic lodge… delete as applicable.
Aaarrgh no, I really liked that shop, it sold some good things and the staff were OK. For God’s sake what’s wrong with this place? What kind of tool puts rents up in a recession. Maybe there’s another tenant lined up. Maybe it’ll turn into a rustic Euro deli cum independent niche bookstore. In our dreams.
New menu at The Castle. Saw some tucking into burgers etc and they looked OK.
Hermits quieter without the arts students. There’s a lot less to look at.
Had a meal in Hoa Viet for the first time in ages. It was OK but nowt special. Cheap pho though, and healthier than a burger. Place still smells a bit too much for my liking.
Shame to lose another independent, but it is part of an inevitable trend towards more supermarket shopping, which is even more heavily subsidised than the NHS.
I am sure there are people unconcerned about this trend at the local masonic lodge (somewhere in Camberwell Grove), believing that Crusons, Sophocles and the Library will go on forever whatever, which they might. But the loss of Metro will make people less likely to visit or stop at Camberwell, as critical mass dissipates incrementally. Almost imperceptibly, from the planners’ drawing boards.
The well-used library at Crossthwaite Avenue was removed by Southwark Council (who own that parade) and replaced with a dry cleaners, which went out of business within a couple of months, and now the unit has been empty for years. Now that parade has a grant for signage (this way to the empty shops) from the Council, betokening its commitment to local shopping.
meanwhile, what they don’t tell you on the council website is that there are plans for running an additional road straight through the wildlife area of the park, building a wall of 10, 15 & 20 storey tower blocks on the side of the park etc http://www.peoplesrepublicofsouthwark.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=130:we-have-lost&catid=4:news&Itemid=3
Back to eating out in Camberwell. Stopped off at the Bear on my way home last night, had a couple of very enjoyable drinks and took the opportunity to review the menu. We decided not to eat due to the crazy prices and the increasingly OTT menu. Sorry Bear, you’re great for drinks but the only food I would go for in you is your sunday roast, which is excellent and worth every penny.
Yeah, it is getting a bit much in there. But, consider that pub burger n chips is £7 elsewhere, then the Bear’s £12 or whatever for a “real” meal doesn’t seem so bad. But I know what you mean, my lass thought the mini roast chicken she had, with veg sides extra, was just too expensive.
SE5 was full of empty restaurants last night. Ambrosia look like they’re suffering. I just don’t think there’s the money and clientele in SE5 for all these places.
Also, where has the Buckle’s not inconsiderable fanbase gone? The Dispensary? The Munky seems to have soaked a few of them up.
I had a great meal in The Bear last Sat. Pork belly, then cherry and almond tart. Delicious. I’m prepared to pay a bit extra for a satisfying meal.
The reason the restaurants are empty in Camberwell (and they were uniformly dead last Sat when I did my rounds) is because they are, by and large, crap. So the trade-off is: crap/cheaper food vs great/more expensive food. It’s up to you.
I think the Dispensary has taken up the Buckle’s clientele. It’s the only pub around here, apart from The Bear, that always has people in it when I pass by.
Correction — Hermits Cave always has people in it as well.
I know we love our pubs here, but I must confess to a little surprise that it’s getting more attention than the Bakerloo extension I posted about previously.
Perhaps because in the 30 years I’ve lived in Camberwell there has been talk of a proposed tube stop every, oh, three or four years. You can generally tell how long people have lived in the area by how optimistic they are about getting the tube stop.
Norman I have to say that The Sun and Doves is generally With People too. Sorry it’s not on the main drag.
The west Coast line proposed from London to Glasgow will cost £70 million a mile. Is that significant in the context of a tube stop in Camberwell?
Went to the Dog & Tulip last night. We had the cyclist. Kings and St Thomas’s keep all the bits in a freezer to supply restaurants. The haunch is excellent, slow-baked with garlic, butter and rosemary.
Mark returning to your earlier discussed idea of standing in the Southwark Borough Council elections next year (sorry been away so just catching up on things here) and generally on raising Camberwell up the political agenda.
Here are my thoughts (I have some experience in this area being a seasoned political campaigner who has been involved in elections for 15 or so years).
First off some background: Southwark at the next local elections is likely to turn Labour whatever happens — Labour already have 28 councillors which is the same number as the Lib Dems. The Lib Dems are only able to govern through an alliance with the Conservatives with 6 councillors.
It could be argued that the Lib Dems have not had a very successful stewardship of the council (lots of cuts, increases in council tax, fires in blocks of flats etc etc) and so are likely to lose seats. The increased popularity of the Conservatives is also likely to affect the Lib Dems in Southwark and so Labour will increase its number of seats regardless.
Now turning to Camberwell: first look at the electoral arithmetic — the map at http://www.southwark.gov.uk/Uploads/FILE_40674.pdf shows there are three maybe four council wards (each with 3 councillors) that contain bits of Camberwell. To have any impact you or any ‘Camberwell Party’ should stand at least one candidate in all of these wards — that way at least you can say that you are campaigning for Camberwell. (this is not to mention the two/three Lambeth wards that contain bits of SE5, in these too the picture is similar although obviously Lambeth has no control over Camberwell town centre)
The results from 2006 are here — http://www.southwark.gov.uk/Uploads/File_27062.pdf and if you see each ward has around 9,000 voters. Turnout at the last election was approximately 30% and the winning candidates in each cases gained around 1,200–2,000 votes. In virtually all cases the Camberwell seats could be said to be ‘safe’ ie the winning candidate gained a clear majority. If you are to win you would need to enthuse 1,500–2,000 people to vote for you. Its doable but would require lots and lots of work starting now to reach out and identify candidates/supporters/backers and generally start to raise the profile of your campaign.
One big factor at the next elections in May 2010 is the general election which will probably be held on the same day (6May). This will increase turnout to approximately 50–60% which will mean that more Labour voters come out to vote (as these generally are the voters most disenfranchised and likely to stay at home/not feel its worth voting in local elections) — the result of this is that Labour will increase seats on the council (aided by the increased support for the Conservatives).
So I guess I’m saying that you would be unlikely to win.
BUT thats not to say that a Camberwell Party if it has several members would not have an impact as Labour and the Lib Dems (and to some extent the Greens; Conservatives are largely irrelevant around here) would have to take account of the points raised.
Any Camberwell Party needs to start now and say produce a ‘manifesto’ for Camberwell with 5–10 key points backed up by research and well argued background material. You need to show that you have the support of wide range of Camberwell people and businesses to have credibility and have several people standing in the area — a single person can be dismissed as an oddball. You would also need to develop good relations with the media: South London Press and Southwark News and other local publications to gain coverage as you will need to gain credibility.
So all in all it will require lots of work with little guaranteed results. The best you could probably hope for was pledges from the incoming Labour administration to implement your wishes.
I had hopes that the SE5 Forum would act as a pressure group for Camberwell but its public affairs influencing strategy if it exists doesnt seem to go that far (or rather I as a normal member havent seen much evidence of it) — the 2010 elections are an excelllent opportunity to raise the profile of the area and demand that politicans take notice but the work needs to be started now.
To be effective in thjis area the SE5 Forum needs to draw up a manifesto for the area and get the parties (especially Labour which has local councillors and as I said is likely to be the next adminstration) to acknowledge and sign up to it and incorporate elements in their manifestos for the 2010 elections. The campaigning needs to start now to gain media coverage and to gain momentum running up to next May’s elections. This work is political but not party political if the Forum tries to influence all parties and so should not come up against any constitutional bans on party politics/ charity commission rules.
Brunswick Park. Come relieve us of the uninterested Sandra Rhule.
On the green near the bus stop near Haart today, in bright warm sunshine, I noticed a middle aged woman leaning oddly against the big tree there. She then leant forwards slightly and I realised she’d been pissing against the tree. No need to pay for the tardis WC in the corner when you can do it like that.
Thanks for the Tube news Peter. I am interested but am also sort of tired of hearing about proposed this proposed that, with nothing happening. When it gets rubber stamped I’ll get more inspired.
Like this high-speed railway announced the other day. I read in the Guardian they hope to have it up by 2030. Jesus, we’ll all be fighting each other for old tins of dogfood by then. 2030? 21 years away? The Chinese would have it built and running in 3 years.
In Korea, certain parts of the cyclist are highly prized.
The plans for Lucas Gardens include a large suspended tyre and a huge hammock, both of which look suitably primitive and tribal like something people in the Amazon would erect for their larks.
The Climate Camp on Blackheath looks exceptionally well organised. In fact, apart from a few children trying to get out through the 10-foot high fencing, it looks like a sort of a Camp Waitrose.
By contrast, the funfair the other side of the road has the thrill of villainy about it. Faces etched by K cider cackle over the antics of their children. A sign on a grub van reads, FOOT LONG HOT DOGS £2.00. A beefy copper was bantering with an ample woman serving there.
The police have a large CCTV control room van to monitor the few people being taken for a ride, which are rather dear. There are many big new 4x4s parked amongst the merrigorounds with personalised number plates like MI BICH.
Thus on one side of the heath yin, whilst the other side yangs.
Barack Dodds has my vote of course.
I’ve just seen the 3 proposed tube routes:
1. E&C — Burgess Park — Peckham Rye — Honor oak.….
2. E&C — Camberwell Green — Herne Hill.….
3. E&C — Burgess Park –Old Kent Rd — Lewisham
Rather typical that the Camberwell option is dismissed as the least viable. Going eastwards to Lewisham is obviously absurd. It already has the train and DLR. And am I missing something or was this tube extension all about getting south London onto the tube map? In which case, why go east?
Great story about the pissing lady. I could beat it with something which was observed in Ruskin park, but this is a family website.
Last but not least, The Bear. I think you get what you pay for there. I’d rather spend my money on one meal of freshly cooked produce than two processed meals elsewhere. And The Bear is doing Camberwell a great service by being good enough to attract people here from other parts of town.
Oh, one more thing. If I put on a hoodie and throw a brick through the Noodel signage, I do hope everyone here will chip in for my bail money.
@mumu — interesting analysis. It’s possible the local Labour vote could be buoyed by guilt at voting them out nationally, as party votes have become an alibi for principles in many cases.
If you check voting figures, you can see variance of up to 20–30% in wards between different candidates of the same party, suggesting there is electoral scope in Camberwell for encouraging a debate on which individuals to vote for.
I’d like to see both the Forum and Camberwell Society both working to encourage people to think about their votes, the incumbents’ records, and each candidate’s views on certain key Camberwell issues. We won’t get a local Labour manifesto at this late stage. Phil G has the right idea in concentrating on why not to vote for specific candidates. More of this please, together with reasons why we should vote for specific candidates, based on track records or pledges. Enough empty “VOTE PARTY X” exhortations please. Justify it.
The “Noodels City” upvc illuminated shop signage — yet another negative side effect of aggressive, totally unregulated free market economics…
Surely„ whoever gave that planning permission needs a good tolchocking around the back of the head with a nicely weighted blunt object…
Eh, Eusebiomate, you went to the Ham for the tolchocking the other day, eh mate? My mate the Ambassador for Millwall — a tough job in diplomacy if ever there is one — said the media fuss was a bit fussy about that, fussing for a story — it was all just down to a few of those funny chaps who live with their mum and like to pitch invade so they can spent more time with their mum when they’re banned.
We tolchocked an ol’ veck.
Love it!
The Noodels sign was erected without permission. So were several other signs round the Camberwell Green area — Christine’s, for example (about which we’ve also made a complaint). But the process of complaint, enforcement action, appeal, final decision does take a very long time.
I will certainly be happy to contribute to Butterball’s bail money!
Do you really need permission to put up a sign? You wouldn’t know.
Back to resturants being empty, I don’t eat out much, but still, there’s a major lack of quality food around the area.
Ganapati is really the only place that serves food that’s worth money.
Then again, I’m a vegetarian, so what do I know.
I’m not bothered about the Tube. A tram or mono rail would be great, though.
Meanwhile, I’d angle for better cycle lanes and maybe “express” bus routes up to town.
No, I was wrong, they don’t need permission, but they must comply with rules regarding size etc. I believe the rules apply generally, not just in conservation areas such as Camberwell Green.
i can’t remember who it was who had some bees in bonnets about inconsiderate cyclists, but it would appear the community support officers have taken the laws into their hands. against the law it would seem
http://www.bikeforall.net/content/cycling_and_the_law.php
On another note, I’ve been finding the Concordia Parkside GP to be quite unimpressive of late, and am planning to change GP. Which Camberwell GPs have you found to be any good?
The Camberwell Green practice is excellent.
St Giles Surgery is very good, so long as you don’t get Dr V
To be fair Upvc signage is one of the most undesirable elements of the present day British high street countrywide…
I think they look cheap,unsightly and contribute to a negative frame of mind which also contributes to anti-social behaviour — if a place looks like a shithouse then it will behave like one!
The quality of local environment is such an underestimated factor in our quality of life…
The only thing which will reverse this trend is when local government realizes the negative effect of this and lobbys central government to give them total powers to be more strict regarding shop signage and shop fronts…
For example:- This would also apply regarding an over-abundance of Off Licenses (who are mainly responsible for poor quality shop fronts and upvc signage)
Dr Begley at St Giles is excellent
On Signage. I put up the sticky back plastic S&D sign myself about seven years ago. It cost about 330 from Bees Auto Bits. It’s still as good as the day it was put up. Not faded, not peeling off. Neat and tidy. Discrete.
I seem to recall that Scottish & Newcastle Pub Enterprises’ ‘Project Manager’ put a part sum of £6000 (I might be exaggerating, it could have been 3K) for signage when I dallied with the idea of allowing them to fund a refurb of the pub in 2003/4 which would have doubled my rent. I withdrew in a barrage of ‘you can’t do that’ statements from them. Well I did because their costs, which I would subsequently have been paying 20% return on capital for, were ludicrous, even before their gravy train cut added.
Stick to the thirty quid sign I say.
Mark…
Precisely…What’s wrong with a discrete painted sign or some lettering that you can stick or screw to the shopfront?
People just have no imagination these days…absolutely shocking — they prefer to drag their knuckles over a PC and flick through Photoshop for Dummies…
A trip down the average high street in London these days is like being forced to watch Walt Disneys TRON through a kaleidoscope…
Something must be done about it! And soon damn it!
Can’t say I disagree one bit eusebiovic.
It crossed my mind yesterday, as I stepped into Butterfly Walk, perusing the range of people passing by, that recently we, as in humans, have learned how to be imitation humans — striving idly to be people like the people in moving media and celebrity mags.
Mumu. Sorry not to have come back to you on your comprehensively excellently detailed post above. Your observations and experience much appreciated. Can we meet fot a chat?
mark@sunanddoves.co.uk
striving idly?
The leaves have begun to fall in Lucas Gardens. The light is leaving us. There is no other explanation. Lack of light makes the leaves turn, not the cold or anything else.
Open House is the weekend of 19 and 20 September — guides are available free at the Town Hall this year, which is good. There are some interesting eco-homes on view in Camberwell and Sunshine House will be open, but alas no William Booth College, normally the uplifting highlight, literally, of the year. From the top of the tower, after climbing the narrow, pigeon-limed spiral stairs, you can see as far as Windsor Castle.
Never mind, Ruby passed through Camberwell yesterday, a class 66 named by Freightliner after the precious stone associated with their 40th anniversary. The 66s are not well loved by gricers, who call them “sheds” because of the shape of the cab, or “ying-yings” because of the noise they make while idling. Ying-yings! They are also known to “clag” frequently — belch diesel exhaust smoke.
Ruby was pulling, all right, clagging probably, with the weight of aggregates bound for London, and the more erudite gricer would have been tempted to sing, Oh Roo-ooo-ooby, don’t take your load to town.
Striving in vain. Driving a train. Striding in rain.
Yup. I wondered about that too. Striving idly. But then that’s what it’s all about, trying hard to be something cool and not what we are. People. Hello. Heat. Grazia. All that stuff. Britain’s Got Talent. Stars In Their Eyes. The Beckhams.
People want to be successful, famous, celebrity, money rich, without wanting to do any of the striving that goes with getting there. Celebrities are made to look as if they got their without effort, obsession, practice, grinding, dedicated hard work. We think celebrities are celebrities because they get their hair cut and blow dried at some salon we should go to to make us celebrities too. Instead of working ahrd at becoming celebrities we strive to be like that by buying white Leather Italian Designer Three Piece Suites and 90 inch plasma screens with surround sound. It makes us feel like we have something of value in our lives when, really, all we have is something godawful to sit on while staring at something even more godawful that’s broadcasting the rest of the jigsaw puzzle of cute suggestions for buying what’ll make us feel even better.
Stiving Idly with eyes and ambitions set on the wrong things.
House prices are all over the place at the moment.
Do a rightmove search on SE5, list most expensive to cheapest.
The most expensive houses are the best and the cheapest flats are the least good but in the middle the link between price and value is spurious.
looks like virtually all of camberwell grove is up for sale, makes me think of sinking ships and things?
Back from a short trip to S France. Well expensive there, and even if the pound hadn’t been so down it still woulda cost.
So, The Observer has caught up. Expect an influx of foodie types to our little secret. And remember, your friend Phil G gave you the lowdown on it way back.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/sep/06/chinese-restaurant-silk-road-london
SG — interested in your comments about Dr V. Is he the other partner working with Dr Begley? If so I think he is my GP. He’s OK but seems unpopular in that I can always get an appointment, or in a few days at least. Also he plays classical music in consultations, which some might find irritating. Not a great listener either.
Anyway, my main beef with this set-up is that I can never get an appointment with Dr Begley. There seems to be some sort of ridiculous situation where she’s so popular that once a week you have to ring up at a certain time on a certain day and you then have a tiny window to book her up. That’s if you can get through to switchboard when this rush is on.
I can only guess that she has a lot of long-term sick, young mums or whatever on her books that must like seeing her time and again. Maybe they should set up some sort of lottery draw so that we all get a change to see her.
As a GP service to me this is virtually useless. In fact thinking about it now I quite resent being registered with an outfit where I can only ever see one GP, so I may look into alternatives. On the other hand, I don’t mind Dr V. Had better for sure, but there are worse.
@ Phil — yes, in my personal experience –and without wishing to be defamatory — Dr V is one of the rudest people I’ve ever met. Friends say similar, one came out from his surgery in tears. He’s just awful. Doesn’t listen and frankly gives the impression of really not caring about you being ill.
Dr Begley is the total other extreme — very caring, nothing too much trouble, has even phoned me at home as a follow up.
I agree she’s very popular, suppose I get around this by going up to the surgery in perosn to make an appointment with her, and getting in very early in the day. I think her first appointment is at 7am.
SG — Interesting, thanks. Remembered now I did manage an appointment with her years ago by chance as V was away. She was nice, it’s true. Guess her approach encourages repeat visits. My GP mate says a lot of his traffic is the same person block booking again and again, often for depression, elderly care, longer-running conditions etc.
I’ll try her next time but last time they said they’ll only take bookings in that time window, which is no use if you’re ill, and only works if you have a longer-term issue you’re prepared to wait for.
Back to the original poster — I guess I wouldn’t really recommend Drs B and V at St Giles. I’m sure there are some better ones. There are 2 or 3 other GPs working out of the same building. Don’t know their names. You get asked when you sign up which lot you want to go with.
Can anyone recommend a dentist? Is that one near Safa good?
@Phil G
I moved to the dentist by Safa — I’ve only been a couple of times but it seems pretty good.
Very money-focused though — everywhere you look it’s about charges — not like my previous one.
Due back there in a week or so — will give an update.
Tried to find the Thai place (used to be in Seymour’s before they changed it to that ‘wine bar’).
I was told it was on Bellenden Road, but walked the entire length (boy is it long) and nada.
Anyone have any info?
Ended up in F M Mangal — another great meal there — and do like the staff — very friendly — even advised us on where to go when we’re in Istanbul shortly.
@ Liliana
This is an excellent time to sell. At the top of the market the banksters are looking to spend their massive bonuses on property, which is dragging the house price average up a little. But mid-range, there isn’t much on the market to compete with. When the banks eventually call time on deliquent mortgages, stressed sales will hit the London market and drive prices lower. If there is another round of tax payer handouts to the banks — which insiders say is quite likely — and unemployment continues to soar, the effect will be even more pronounced.
That said, some newspapers are dismissing economic fundamentals and shouting about now being a buyers market. And an ad I just heard on Spotify claims there’s never been a better time to buy. So who’s to say I’m right?! It’s certainly true that the government has structured our economy — and recession strategy — around maintaining high house prices and massive leverage.
Phil G — I recently registered with the dentist near Safa. I’ve a ten month old baby so treatment is free for me at the moment. I expected to be fobbed off with a bit of a scale and polish but she couldn’t have been nicer or more professional — took an impression to make something for me to wear at night to discourage teeth grinding, x-rays to see if I’ve any ‘hidden’ decay, gave me a really thorough clean and polish and booked me in for a filling next week. I’m very impressed so far.
I may go with the Safa neighbours then, thanks.
There’s also that place just up the road towards the church near the barbers. Anyone tried it?
They say the food there is full of hair clippings to bulk up the protein content.
Dagmar, perhaps Phil G was thinking Dentist rather than Food? But hey. Hair clippings probably work as well in dentistry as in bas cuisine.
Life’s a joy isn’t it?